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Monday, June 10, 2013

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Source(google.com.pk)
This is with reference to the spelling Shalwar Qamis and a redirect from Shalwar Qamis leading to this article. Shalwar Qamis is a non-standard spelling where as Salwar Kamiz is a standard spelling. The former generates 139 hits while the latter generates 7,00,000+ hits on Google. Also, I'd like to say that consensus should not be at the cost of credibility of Wikipedia. --Gurubrahma 08:02, 29 November 2005 .
I think that's some anon Pakistani editor who feels that the Indian version of the word is being favored. Just as we had an anon Indian editor who wanted to remove all connection between salwar kamiz and Islamic invaders from Central Asia. People are refighting the Partition over the unlikeliest topics imaginable! I'll remove the ref. Can you remove the redirect? Zora 09:02, 29 November 2005 .
I agree that we should favor the vastly more common spelling, but I don't think mentioning the alternate spelling hurts, and I strenuously disagree with eliminating the redirect page, if that's what is being suggested. Redirect pages are virtually free; even if such a page only helps a small minority of users, it's worth it. -Rholton 13:28, 29 November 2005 .
I don't think the alternate spelling should be mentioned. The Pakistani I know spells it "Shalwar kamiz" anyways... but, I'm for removing it in the intro but keeping a redirect. gren グレン 17:04, 6 January 2006 .
It is interesting how Khat-Partug (Shalwar kamiz) are now either Punjabi, Pakistani or Indian dress code. Khat Partug is the Pashtun/Afghan or "Pathan" dress code. It was known as Pathani in India, and still is known by this name. Punjabis adopted it, and Sikhs adopted after countless invasion by Ahmed Shah Abdali, and later their rule over the Peshawar valley the Sikhs adopted many other customs, Bhangra, a local dance called "Bangray" which means a ring. Bangray or Balbala was is a domesticed version of the Afghan warrior dance ATTAN, whiceh is performed by men before going to war. They also adopted the rooster turban, the type you see today the border guards of India and Pakistan wearing. The Indian/Pakistani dress code are Lungi, Dhoti and Sari. Afghans introduced this type of dress code with their countless rules over a span of 800 years. Iranian, Turks don't wear anything close to Khat Partug, there clothing is more like Arab. From the word "Khata", means dirt, the British invented Khaki (meti color), another dress code that originated during the time of Anglo Afghans wars. Today it is known as Khaki Warde worn by government employees in India. Keray (Pathani Chapal) are now famous in both India and Pakistan. Karakul Afghan hat is also famous, worn by both Jinnah and Hamid Karzai. Pakhtun hat, or Afghan war hat is now famous all over the Muslim world after its famous use in Afghan-Russo war.
You are absoltely correct. Punjabis and Sindhis adopted this dress from Pashtuns and Balochs and in the 70s Pakistan made it its national dress because the bulk of its population used to wear it, and the famous soap operas of Pakistan Television made it popular in India in the 80s. Before the Muslim rule Indians were unaware of stiched clothes and used to wear Sari and Lungi. It is ironic that once pure Pashtun/Afghan historical dress and attire is now known as Indian in the world who adopted it just two or three decades ago.Asfandshah (talk) 21:52, 14 April 2011 .
I suggest you guys update this article, the dress code of Punjabi/Pakistan/India was Lungi, Dhoti, and Sari. Khat Partug (shalwar kamiz) originated with Afghans horse riders (Asvazais/Yousafzais). Even Mughul used to wear long skirts over pajamas, while Afghans/Pathans wore KHAT PARTUG (shalwar kamis), and was known as Pathani in those days. Khat Partug today is also famous over Muslim world because of it spread from again Afgan Russo war. American wore it, and British wore it. Arabs took this dress to their countries. Today it is famous all over mosques in North Americas. So is the Afghan hat. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sync2k5 (talk • contribs)
Sync, your claims sound suspiciously nationalistic to me but ... I don't think we have any good articles on the HISTORY of costume in South Asia. There's a little bit of history in the Sari article and a little in this article. Rather than use current "national" units, however, it seems to me to make more sense to write articles about court costume and peasant costume under the Ghaznavids, Mughals, Marathas, etc. Their territories just don't coincide with the lines on contemporary maps. Zora 23:57, 8 January 2006 .
Shalwar Kamis is associated with Islam, and who were the Islamic rulers of India before the Mughul? Sayyed, Lodhi, Suri, Ghori, Ghaznavi, Abdali etc. all Afghans. To mention “Persian” and “Turkic” but not to mention Afghanistan where this dress code is practiced by 99 percent of the people compared to Iran/Turkey, where many won’t even know what it is, is ridiculous and poor research. Salwar Kamis also became famous because of the influence of NWFP, Khans, and Pathans over Pakistan. These are historical facts, nothing “suspiciously nationalistic” about them. Unless you can provide concrete evidence to say otherwise, I suggest less assumptions and more common sense. There are other famous Afghan influences that are never mentioned at all, tanduri (Pakhto/Pashto = tanur = oven) Shish Kabab (Pakhto/Pashto=Shish/Sikh = metal) etc. etc.The misspelling of shalwar kamiz
The proper word and spelling of the dress is SHALWAR KAMIZ OR QAMIZ not Salwar kamiz which used only by non urdu, non pashto speaking inhabitants of India. The word itself is of Pashto origin and is pronounced with a voicles ALveopalatal "SHHHHH" sound not a voiceless Alveoloar "SS" sound. Please let the correctons stand. Also if any one can change the Main title spelling to Shalwar kamiz that would be great as well. But Salwar as an alternative specific geographical pronounciation should be indeed mentioned. Thankyou, omerlivesOmerlives 00:30, 5 March 2006 .
Your opinion is welcome, but the spelling Salwar Kamiz is more common. The proverbial google test reveals 100 times more hits (1.2 Million vs 13,000) for Salwar Kamiz as compared to Shalwar Qamiz. So, according to Wikipedia convention, this article is correctly using the spelling. You might look above for more discussion on the topic. Thanks. --Ragib 01:16, 5 March 2006.
Dear Nagib, From whence is the spelling more common? First off that is a totaly irrelevant thing. The proper pronounciation does not depend upon how many people pronounce a certain thing some way but on the speakers of langauge for whom it is the mother tongue. And in the least it should be desgnated as the main pronounciatoin before geographical alterntive adaptations are considered. Even so Google returns more than double the hits for shalwar kamiz than salwar kamiz i:e 1.47 million vs. 684k. But this is not by any stretch any criteria or method to pick and choose terms God forbid. Unless one wants a comic releif. I am changing the article back to the more accurate form. Please donot change th article lest I report you. Please feel free to convey as to why Salwar Kamiz be the main spelling. omerlivesOmerlives 01:29, 5 March 2006 (UTC)
I changed everything back. Please don't be silly. If encyclopedia users want to find out about salwar kamiz, they are going to type in the term that they know. In language, majority rules -- and in this case, salwar kamiz has become an English word. You can spell the word as you like in the Urdu Wikipedia, if there is one, but this is the English Wikipedia and we use the terms that are the most common in English. Zora 02:07, 5 March 2006 .
I agree with Zora. Regarding google's results, did you really use google and found out "Shalwar Kamiz" gives more results? Because right now, I checked back, and "Shalwar Kamiz" returns 148,000 results whereas "salwar kamiz" returns 1.2 million results. The point is, using the more common term is a tradition in wikipedia, and that's what is being applied here. It is not something like misspelling of a south asian word by non-south-asians ... rather the usage of a more common spelling as used in the region where salwar kamiz is prevalent. Thanks. --Ragib 02:25, 5 March 2006.

Source(google.com.pk)
This is with reference to the spelling Shalwar Qamis and a redirect from Shalwar Qamis leading to this article. Shalwar Qamis is a non-standard spelling where as Salwar Kamiz is a standard spelling. The former generates 139 hits while the latter generates 7,00,000+ hits on Google. Also, I'd like to say that consensus should not be at the cost of credibility of Wikipedia. --Gurubrahma 08:02, 29 November 2005 .
I think that's some anon Pakistani editor who feels that the Indian version of the word is being favored. Just as we had an anon Indian editor who wanted to remove all connection between salwar kamiz and Islamic invaders from Central Asia. People are refighting the Partition over the unlikeliest topics imaginable! I'll remove the ref. Can you remove the redirect? Zora 09:02, 29 November 2005 .
I agree that we should favor the vastly more common spelling, but I don't think mentioning the alternate spelling hurts, and I strenuously disagree with eliminating the redirect page, if that's what is being suggested. Redirect pages are virtually free; even if such a page only helps a small minority of users, it's worth it. -Rholton 13:28, 29 November 2005 .
I don't think the alternate spelling should be mentioned. The Pakistani I know spells it "Shalwar kamiz" anyways... but, I'm for removing it in the intro but keeping a redirect. gren グレン 17:04, 6 January 2006 .
It is interesting how Khat-Partug (Shalwar kamiz) are now either Punjabi, Pakistani or Indian dress code. Khat Partug is the Pashtun/Afghan or "Pathan" dress code. It was known as Pathani in India, and still is known by this name. Punjabis adopted it, and Sikhs adopted after countless invasion by Ahmed Shah Abdali, and later their rule over the Peshawar valley the Sikhs adopted many other customs, Bhangra, a local dance called "Bangray" which means a ring. Bangray or Balbala was is a domesticed version of the Afghan warrior dance ATTAN, whiceh is performed by men before going to war. They also adopted the rooster turban, the type you see today the border guards of India and Pakistan wearing. The Indian/Pakistani dress code are Lungi, Dhoti and Sari. Afghans introduced this type of dress code with their countless rules over a span of 800 years. Iranian, Turks don't wear anything close to Khat Partug, there clothing is more like Arab. From the word "Khata", means dirt, the British invented Khaki (meti color), another dress code that originated during the time of Anglo Afghans wars. Today it is known as Khaki Warde worn by government employees in India. Keray (Pathani Chapal) are now famous in both India and Pakistan. Karakul Afghan hat is also famous, worn by both Jinnah and Hamid Karzai. Pakhtun hat, or Afghan war hat is now famous all over the Muslim world after its famous use in Afghan-Russo war.
You are absoltely correct. Punjabis and Sindhis adopted this dress from Pashtuns and Balochs and in the 70s Pakistan made it its national dress because the bulk of its population used to wear it, and the famous soap operas of Pakistan Television made it popular in India in the 80s. Before the Muslim rule Indians were unaware of stiched clothes and used to wear Sari and Lungi. It is ironic that once pure Pashtun/Afghan historical dress and attire is now known as Indian in the world who adopted it just two or three decades ago.Asfandshah (talk) 21:52, 14 April 2011 .
I suggest you guys update this article, the dress code of Punjabi/Pakistan/India was Lungi, Dhoti, and Sari. Khat Partug (shalwar kamiz) originated with Afghans horse riders (Asvazais/Yousafzais). Even Mughul used to wear long skirts over pajamas, while Afghans/Pathans wore KHAT PARTUG (shalwar kamis), and was known as Pathani in those days. Khat Partug today is also famous over Muslim world because of it spread from again Afgan Russo war. American wore it, and British wore it. Arabs took this dress to their countries. Today it is famous all over mosques in North Americas. So is the Afghan hat. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sync2k5 (talk • contribs)
Sync, your claims sound suspiciously nationalistic to me but ... I don't think we have any good articles on the HISTORY of costume in South Asia. There's a little bit of history in the Sari article and a little in this article. Rather than use current "national" units, however, it seems to me to make more sense to write articles about court costume and peasant costume under the Ghaznavids, Mughals, Marathas, etc. Their territories just don't coincide with the lines on contemporary maps. Zora 23:57, 8 January 2006 .
Shalwar Kamis is associated with Islam, and who were the Islamic rulers of India before the Mughul? Sayyed, Lodhi, Suri, Ghori, Ghaznavi, Abdali etc. all Afghans. To mention “Persian” and “Turkic” but not to mention Afghanistan where this dress code is practiced by 99 percent of the people compared to Iran/Turkey, where many won’t even know what it is, is ridiculous and poor research. Salwar Kamis also became famous because of the influence of NWFP, Khans, and Pathans over Pakistan. These are historical facts, nothing “suspiciously nationalistic” about them. Unless you can provide concrete evidence to say otherwise, I suggest less assumptions and more common sense. There are other famous Afghan influences that are never mentioned at all, tanduri (Pakhto/Pashto = tanur = oven) Shish Kabab (Pakhto/Pashto=Shish/Sikh = metal) etc. etc.The misspelling of shalwar kamiz
The proper word and spelling of the dress is SHALWAR KAMIZ OR QAMIZ not Salwar kamiz which used only by non urdu, non pashto speaking inhabitants of India. The word itself is of Pashto origin and is pronounced with a voicles ALveopalatal "SHHHHH" sound not a voiceless Alveoloar "SS" sound. Please let the correctons stand. Also if any one can change the Main title spelling to Shalwar kamiz that would be great as well. But Salwar as an alternative specific geographical pronounciation should be indeed mentioned. Thankyou, omerlivesOmerlives 00:30, 5 March 2006 .
Your opinion is welcome, but the spelling Salwar Kamiz is more common. The proverbial google test reveals 100 times more hits (1.2 Million vs 13,000) for Salwar Kamiz as compared to Shalwar Qamiz. So, according to Wikipedia convention, this article is correctly using the spelling. You might look above for more discussion on the topic. Thanks. --Ragib 01:16, 5 March 2006.
Dear Nagib, From whence is the spelling more common? First off that is a totaly irrelevant thing. The proper pronounciation does not depend upon how many people pronounce a certain thing some way but on the speakers of langauge for whom it is the mother tongue. And in the least it should be desgnated as the main pronounciatoin before geographical alterntive adaptations are considered. Even so Google returns more than double the hits for shalwar kamiz than salwar kamiz i:e 1.47 million vs. 684k. But this is not by any stretch any criteria or method to pick and choose terms God forbid. Unless one wants a comic releif. I am changing the article back to the more accurate form. Please donot change th article lest I report you. Please feel free to convey as to why Salwar Kamiz be the main spelling. omerlivesOmerlives 01:29, 5 March 2006 (UTC)
I changed everything back. Please don't be silly. If encyclopedia users want to find out about salwar kamiz, they are going to type in the term that they know. In language, majority rules -- and in this case, salwar kamiz has become an English word. You can spell the word as you like in the Urdu Wikipedia, if there is one, but this is the English Wikipedia and we use the terms that are the most common in English. Zora 02:07, 5 March 2006 .
I agree with Zora. Regarding google's results, did you really use google and found out "Shalwar Kamiz" gives more results? Because right now, I checked back, and "Shalwar Kamiz" returns 148,000 results whereas "salwar kamiz" returns 1.2 million results. The point is, using the more common term is a tradition in wikipedia, and that's what is being applied here. It is not something like misspelling of a south asian word by non-south-asians ... rather the usage of a more common spelling as used in the region where salwar kamiz is prevalent. Thanks. --Ragib 02:25, 5 March 2006.
Source(google.com.pk)
This is with reference to the spelling Shalwar Qamis and a redirect from Shalwar Qamis leading to this article. Shalwar Qamis is a non-standard spelling where as Salwar Kamiz is a standard spelling. The former generates 139 hits while the latter generates 7,00,000+ hits on Google. Also, I'd like to say that consensus should not be at the cost of credibility of Wikipedia. --Gurubrahma 08:02, 29 November 2005 .
I think that's some anon Pakistani editor who feels that the Indian version of the word is being favored. Just as we had an anon Indian editor who wanted to remove all connection between salwar kamiz and Islamic invaders from Central Asia. People are refighting the Partition over the unlikeliest topics imaginable! I'll remove the ref. Can you remove the redirect? Zora 09:02, 29 November 2005 .
I agree that we should favor the vastly more common spelling, but I don't think mentioning the alternate spelling hurts, and I strenuously disagree with eliminating the redirect page, if that's what is being suggested. Redirect pages are virtually free; even if such a page only helps a small minority of users, it's worth it. -Rholton 13:28, 29 November 2005 .
I don't think the alternate spelling should be mentioned. The Pakistani I know spells it "Shalwar kamiz" anyways... but, I'm for removing it in the intro but keeping a redirect. gren グレン 17:04, 6 January 2006 .
It is interesting how Khat-Partug (Shalwar kamiz) are now either Punjabi, Pakistani or Indian dress code. Khat Partug is the Pashtun/Afghan or "Pathan" dress code. It was known as Pathani in India, and still is known by this name. Punjabis adopted it, and Sikhs adopted after countless invasion by Ahmed Shah Abdali, and later their rule over the Peshawar valley the Sikhs adopted many other customs, Bhangra, a local dance called "Bangray" which means a ring. Bangray or Balbala was is a domesticed version of the Afghan warrior dance ATTAN, whiceh is performed by men before going to war. They also adopted the rooster turban, the type you see today the border guards of India and Pakistan wearing. The Indian/Pakistani dress code are Lungi, Dhoti and Sari. Afghans introduced this type of dress code with their countless rules over a span of 800 years. Iranian, Turks don't wear anything close to Khat Partug, there clothing is more like Arab. From the word "Khata", means dirt, the British invented Khaki (meti color), another dress code that originated during the time of Anglo Afghans wars. Today it is known as Khaki Warde worn by government employees in India. Keray (Pathani Chapal) are now famous in both India and Pakistan. Karakul Afghan hat is also famous, worn by both Jinnah and Hamid Karzai. Pakhtun hat, or Afghan war hat is now famous all over the Muslim world after its famous use in Afghan-Russo war.
You are absoltely correct. Punjabis and Sindhis adopted this dress from Pashtuns and Balochs and in the 70s Pakistan made it its national dress because the bulk of its population used to wear it, and the famous soap operas of Pakistan Television made it popular in India in the 80s. Before the Muslim rule Indians were unaware of stiched clothes and used to wear Sari and Lungi. It is ironic that once pure Pashtun/Afghan historical dress and attire is now known as Indian in the world who adopted it just two or three decades ago.Asfandshah (talk) 21:52, 14 April 2011 .
I suggest you guys update this article, the dress code of Punjabi/Pakistan/India was Lungi, Dhoti, and Sari. Khat Partug (shalwar kamiz) originated with Afghans horse riders (Asvazais/Yousafzais). Even Mughul used to wear long skirts over pajamas, while Afghans/Pathans wore KHAT PARTUG (shalwar kamis), and was known as Pathani in those days. Khat Partug today is also famous over Muslim world because of it spread from again Afgan Russo war. American wore it, and British wore it. Arabs took this dress to their countries. Today it is famous all over mosques in North Americas. So is the Afghan hat. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sync2k5 (talk • contribs)
Sync, your claims sound suspiciously nationalistic to me but ... I don't think we have any good articles on the HISTORY of costume in South Asia. There's a little bit of history in the Sari article and a little in this article. Rather than use current "national" units, however, it seems to me to make more sense to write articles about court costume and peasant costume under the Ghaznavids, Mughals, Marathas, etc. Their territories just don't coincide with the lines on contemporary maps. Zora 23:57, 8 January 2006 .
Shalwar Kamis is associated with Islam, and who were the Islamic rulers of India before the Mughul? Sayyed, Lodhi, Suri, Ghori, Ghaznavi, Abdali etc. all Afghans. To mention “Persian” and “Turkic” but not to mention Afghanistan where this dress code is practiced by 99 percent of the people compared to Iran/Turkey, where many won’t even know what it is, is ridiculous and poor research. Salwar Kamis also became famous because of the influence of NWFP, Khans, and Pathans over Pakistan. These are historical facts, nothing “suspiciously nationalistic” about them. Unless you can provide concrete evidence to say otherwise, I suggest less assumptions and more common sense. There are other famous Afghan influences that are never mentioned at all, tanduri (Pakhto/Pashto = tanur = oven) Shish Kabab (Pakhto/Pashto=Shish/Sikh = metal) etc. etc.The misspelling of shalwar kamiz
The proper word and spelling of the dress is SHALWAR KAMIZ OR QAMIZ not Salwar kamiz which used only by non urdu, non pashto speaking inhabitants of India. The word itself is of Pashto origin and is pronounced with a voicles ALveopalatal "SHHHHH" sound not a voiceless Alveoloar "SS" sound. Please let the correctons stand. Also if any one can change the Main title spelling to Shalwar kamiz that would be great as well. But Salwar as an alternative specific geographical pronounciation should be indeed mentioned. Thankyou, omerlivesOmerlives 00:30, 5 March 2006 .
Your opinion is welcome, but the spelling Salwar Kamiz is more common. The proverbial google test reveals 100 times more hits (1.2 Million vs 13,000) for Salwar Kamiz as compared to Shalwar Qamiz. So, according to Wikipedia convention, this article is correctly using the spelling. You might look above for more discussion on the topic. Thanks. --Ragib 01:16, 5 March 2006.
Dear Nagib, From whence is the spelling more common? First off that is a totaly irrelevant thing. The proper pronounciation does not depend upon how many people pronounce a certain thing some way but on the speakers of langauge for whom it is the mother tongue. And in the least it should be desgnated as the main pronounciatoin before geographical alterntive adaptations are considered. Even so Google returns more than double the hits for shalwar kamiz than salwar kamiz i:e 1.47 million vs. 684k. But this is not by any stretch any criteria or method to pick and choose terms God forbid. Unless one wants a comic releif. I am changing the article back to the more accurate form. Please donot change th article lest I report you. Please feel free to convey as to why Salwar Kamiz be the main spelling. omerlivesOmerlives 01:29, 5 March 2006 (UTC)
I changed everything back. Please don't be silly. If encyclopedia users want to find out about salwar kamiz, they are going to type in the term that they know. In language, majority rules -- and in this case, salwar kamiz has become an English word. You can spell the word as you like in the Urdu Wikipedia, if there is one, but this is the English Wikipedia and we use the terms that are the most common in English. Zora 02:07, 5 March 2006 .
I agree with Zora. Regarding google's results, did you really use google and found out "Shalwar Kamiz" gives more results? Because right now, I checked back, and "Shalwar Kamiz" returns 148,000 results whereas "salwar kamiz" returns 1.2 million results. The point is, using the more common term is a tradition in wikipedia, and that's what is being applied here. It is not something like misspelling of a south asian word by non-south-asians ... rather the usage of a more common spelling as used in the region where salwar kamiz is prevalent. Thanks. --Ragib 02:25, 5 March 2006.